Rodrigo:

How many times have we felt? We are not good enough. How many times have we compared to others and have fallen shorts? That’s the story of today’s guests Bhavna Toor. She went from being that shy person always at the back of the room to working in Wall Street, Treats and today since championing. mindful leadership, today’s episode, we are going to cover topics, such as how to find your purpose, how to be more self-aware or to be more self-discipline. And how can you Empower others? I hope you enjoy this episode. Stay tuned.

It’s such a pleasure to have you on the show. Welcome.

 

Bhavna Toor

Thank you. Thank you. It’s such a pleasure to be here.

 

Rodrigo:

Yes. All right. So, I think a good place to start is to understand what is by, are you to start working with mindful leadership?

 

Bhavna Toor:

I think my journey towards mindfulness and mindfully der ship began almost 10 years ago. I was living in New York had a career in finance. So, on the surface, everything looked great. I was making good money living comfortably in the glitziest city in the world. But on the inside, to be honest, there was this growing sense of discontentment within me that this couldn’t be it. It, there was this, the voice inside me, just kept getting louder and louder and louder questioning. If this was the answer, I thought about how yes, I’ve been part of this Rat Race for as long as I can remember. But where am I running to? And how can I be sure that wherever I’m running to is the answer that it will give me that sense of meaning and purpose that I was looking for, and because I knew this wasn’t it. I knew I had to do something very A different dance especially after business school when Noah the career path was appealing to me. I made the somewhat dramatic decision at the time to move to India a country, I hadn’t lived in four decades, because I knew I had to give myself that time and space to find my own. path. And so, the next few years in India, became a spiritual Odyssey for me where I was just seeking searching finding, and Answers to all the big questions in life that we all Wrestle with. Who am I? Why am I here? What I what am I meant to do? And at that time, when I was searching for a friend of mine suggested, I try vipassana meditation. It was not something I had ever tried before, but I was ready to try anything. And so, I jumped into the deep end of the pool and signed up for a 10-day vipassana meditation. Program in is the same city where Buddha famously gained Enlightenment. So, I thought I could fast-track my Enlightenment going to the same city and the aha moment I had during that, that, that program was that for years, I was seeking and searching so desperately for answers, but I was always looking outside of myself. Reading every book, I could read taking every program. I could Find when all I had to do was create that time and space to go within to look for that. Truth within to find that wisdom within as roomy. Famously said you Wander from room to room to room searching for that diamond necklace, that was always around your neck. And so, for me, my journey to living at leading mindfully has really been about training myself. To see that necklace to Value it and appreciated and also to help others find their truth and wisdom.

 

Rodrigo:

Wow, that’s such as such an inspiring journey. I think would be nice to understand. So how did you find your purpose? And how can people also find their purpose?

 

Bhavna Toor:

That such a big and important question that I think we all think about, I think, every single person, Son I’ve ever met is trying to find the meaning of their life and in my journey. If there’s one thing, I realized is that the meaning of our life is not something that’s out there for us to discover and find, but we have to choose to give meaning to our lives. Now, how do we do that? For me, it was very much about finding that meeting at the Intersection of my curiosity and my compassion. Now, what is that? Well, first curiosity, I always ask people to think about, okay? What are you curious about, not what you’re passionate about, because I think that word passion can be intimidating at times, especially if you haven’t found your passion. But if you are a human being, you are innately curious about something. You think about something, Thing, what is that for me? When I ask myself that question initially, when I moved to India in my mind, I thought okay I’m going to go into a career into social impact investing because that seemed like a natural extension from my background in finance and I thought I could use my finance for social good.

But then when I actually asked myself, what was I spending my time thinking about reading about exploring with no external pressure know Expectations whatsoever. And in my room, I looked at this stack of books piled high from floor to ceiling every single book was about personal growth mindfulness leadership. And that’s when I was like, okay I think this is trying to tell me something. I think this this is this is what is naturally calling me. And so that’s where I found my curiosity and then the Question is. Once you, once you find what you are curious about, how do you take that thing that you’re interested in and then build it and build it and build it to the point where you can help others, that’s compassion, compassion, is wanting to reduce the suffering of others. Compassion is working towards the well-being of others. And so, when I thought about, okay? How do I take this passion? This curiosity that I have four. Personal growth work and mindfulness? How do I help others? And who would I like to help for me? The answer was clear. I wanted to help other women because I knew the kind of struggles, I had gone through in finding my voice and I knew, because of the kind of cultural forces, you see around the world still whether it’s us India, wherever that women do, struggle in both finding and expressing their authenticity. And I Believed mindfulness could be the answer for other women as well. And so that’s how I found my purpose at the intersection of my curiosity. And compassion.

 

Rodrigo:

I love your journey and it’s I really resonate because I also went through the same, and I think it’s so interesting. When we, there’s so much noise in our head, and we’re always looking outside, but when we go inside, that’s when all the answers happen. And that’s also what happened with me. I think my necklace. Also, I found my necklace when I went through a process of meditation, and I also found also a lot of what I was going to do came in that process. So, we so now so now this brings us to two mindful leadership. So, what is it? And what differs from the traditional leadership? I think at the fundamental level mindfulness is, is Different in two ways. One mindfulness is about fundamentally, it’s about Living and leading with self-awareness. Learning about yourself, understanding yourself. I think it was loud to who said understanding others is intelligence, is intelligence, understanding yourself is wisdom So it’s self-awareness, which gives us that path to wisdom. So that’s the first thing. The second thing mindfulness is about leading from within understanding that all change begins with us. So, in a traditional approach to leadership, we ask questions, like, how do I lead others? How do I motivate others? How do I create an inspiring vision for others? In mindfulness, you take that lens and You, you turn it towards yourself, and you ask how can I lead myself? How can I motivate myself? How can I create an inspiring vision for myself? So that I can then do it for others? So instead of externalizing challenges and thinking that the problem and the solution lie outside of me, you asked, what can I do? So instead of, oh, I have this really demanding boss, I don’t know what to do with you. Ask, how can I be more assertive with what my needs are? Instead of if only I my spouse or my partner or my child wasn’t so difficult, you ask, how can I Show up more fully. How can I create that welcoming and nurturing space for others? Also, to show up more fully.

Yeah, and especially today where there’s so much uncertainty, right? Yeah. So, you really need to First really understand yourself so that you are able to navigate these an uncertainty really nice. But what makes you believe that its mindful leadership is really effective. I think it’s a combination of three things, one, my own experience, my own Journey, how the more and more I have sought to live and lead. More, mindfully how I found greater peace greater happiness greater success as well in my in my life. I’ve seen this now working with thousands of women and all of this is also supported by considerable. Research at this point, they’ve been if I’m not mistaken over 16,000 Scientific articles and studies published in journals around the benefits of mindfulness and how it can help all of us. So, I think all of that is really pointing to the same thing that when all of us, take the time to do that in our work to go within to focus on that that personal growth, which is how we magnify our impact in the world.

 

Rodrigo:

Okay, so one is your personal experience. Also, you saw so many thousands of women, which it worked with them, but also their scientific articles showing like the importance of mindfulness in business. That’s really cool. I could see that you were very when I asked this question, you were very passionate, and you were feeling like that’s it. That’s not so easy answer. But so, when you look at what’s happening in business, Today, what breaks your heart?

 

Bhavna Toor:

I think what breaks my heart is that we’re still living in a world where half the population of the world which is women are still struggling to find their place in the world just to give you a quick example. One of the programs that we run is a fellowship program for young women. This is women from 21 to 30 called lead like a girl, it’s a fellow Ship program where we offer scholarships to everyone majority of the women. And this year in particular, we’ve been receiving applications from all around the world. Women from Pakistan Afghanistan, Nepal, Indonesia, all countries in Africa and one of the questions we always ask is tell us what is that one thing you’re struggling with that? That we can support you with and woman after woman after woman, I’ve been reading these emails Al’s in my inbox over the last few weeks and each of them breaks my heart because they’re all saying the same thing. I don’t know if I’m good enough. I don’t know how I can do more. I’m struggling with self-doubt. I’m struggling with the Imposter syndrome. I’m struggling with confidence. I’m struggling to find my voice. It’s all pointing to the same thing. So how can we create a better world, where everyone, everyone feels like they belong. And for me, that work, Work. Has to focus on women because of the vast majority of them are still struggling. And why do you think they are struggling? I think it’s a combination of two things. I think when it comes to Self-Doubt, for sure. It’s Universal. It’s not just that women struggle with self-doubt. I know many men who also struggle in with that, and a lot of that is just our internal wiring our Gene that predisposes us to pick out the negatives. More than the positives. This negativity bias that we have. So, for sure, part of it is just the wiring of our brain, but the second reason I do think, is the cultural forces that we see in the world, the patriarchy, if you will, that holds, that makes that gets women to internalize this notion of constantly wanting to prove themselves constantly feeling like they need to prove that they’re good enough in the workplace at home even physically. There’s this constant pressure to hold ourselves up to this impossible standard.

It’s an impossible standard that we’ve all set up because we feel that is what is expected of us. We need to prove that we’re twice as good as our male. Auto Parts to be considered just as good. And because the bar is so high, we are constant where we are constantly falling short and because we’re falling short, we constantly feel like we’re failing and we’re not good enough. So, I think absolutely the cultural and societal conditioning plays a huge role in that.

 

Rodrigo:

So that’s why also the self-awareness not just in men, but also women, it’s a big part of what you think, it’s the solution today, right? But what’s happening today around this topic of let’s say mindful leadership. What are some of the misconceptions and myths that you see around this topic?

 

Bhavna Toor:

So, let’s look at the current state of affairs. So, if you look at the latest women in the workplace report that Mackenzie came out with what we now know, is that for every woman that is joining an organization at a senior level, let’s say a director level two, women are leaving the organization. Now, why is that happening? We’ve been asking this question to Arc posing. This question to us for three years in a row, asking the same question. What causes you to leave either move from one organization to another or leave the workforce altogether, is it because you’re leaving for personal reasons. You want to take care of your family, or aging parents. Are you leaving? Because you just are burnt out and you want time out, are you leaving for more challenging work of a better-paying work? Or are you leaving because you feel undervalued? Three years in a row answer has not changed fifty-one. Percent of all women have told us year after year after year, they leave when they feel undervalued. So that begs the question well what will make you feel value? What will get you to stay? And again, the answer time and time again, is one, I want a workplace that truly prioritizes my well-being. I want to workplace where I can work with flexibility, I have the flexible working options, given the realities of my life and third, I want a workplace that truly in spirit, not just on paper committed to creating that culture where everyone can belong true, diversity and inclusion. What is that workplace? That a workplace where everyone can belong, is a compassionate workplace who creates a compassionate workplace, come. Compassionate leaders’ mindful leaders who are self-aware who are thinking deeply about how they can show up and create that welcoming and nurturing place. Where everyone feels like they’re seeing their heard their value, their respected. Yeah, yeah. And how can we build that? How do we create such a workplace? I do think the work begins with leaders because it all trickles down from there. In fact, whenever we’ve asked women. So, when you are, when you join an organization, how do you know how do you know that this is? This is a truly Equitable, truly inclusive workplace. And one of the things, a lot of people will always point to is. Well, you look at you, look at the leaders, right? You look at what they are saying. You look at how they are, going up you look at how they’re treating that one woman who’s in the room who’s Perhaps, perhaps is not getting an opportunity to speak is being talked. Over is being dismissed. How are they making sure that she’s hurt? Jeez included. So, I do think the work begins with, with Leaders, with male and female leaders, really doing that work to show up in in that way and create that environment for everyone. Everybody else.

 

Rodrigo:

Do you have any example of that you’ve seen any organization doing a really good job on creating that workplace that you are mentioning I think over the years?

 

Bhavna Toor:

Yes, I think that’s one thing I will say. Especially when I think about from where I started my career, 20 years ago, there was no very little talk. I would say, around diversity inclusion, to the extent, there is today. So fortunately, yes, Now, my work has exposed me to several organizations where they are talking walking. The walk, not just talking about this and, and yes, it is. It is all of the things that we’ve been talking about how, where leaders are truly role modelling. Role modelling, mindful compassionate leadership. Practicing inclusion. Not Just again, not just at a high level, but your day-to-day day-to-day small, tiny micro interactions because that is really what makes a difference? Because again, what, you know, when we, when we asked women, what causes them to leave, it’s never just one or two big things. What they always say. It’s a series of micro inequities and micro aggressions that they that they experienced over the course of their career. It’s that classic. Death By a Thousand Cuts, you flip that over to make any one-woman person of any background feel included. You have to focus on those many, many, many, many acts of micro inclusion day, today, today, how we speak to someone, how we, how we make them seem. Make them feel heard respected through every single interaction. So, I think where there’s truly Organizations that truly create that kind of culture is where we’ve seen. They’re also experiencing tangible. Benefits in terms of high performance, in terms of Greater Innovation, all of the tangible outcomes that any business would want. And what I do think that those benefits on focusing from on mindful leadership, I think the benefits are on multiple levels. I think. If I start, we can look at the benefits in on an individual level. And we can look at the benefits on a larger organizational, or societal level at the individual level. Here is the thing. And one of the, the biggest things that I emphasize in my work and what is a big, Cornerstone of mindfulness is really practicing more. Anything else self-compassion self-compassion because going back to what we were talking about earlier. How are women? We have internalized this notion that we’re not good enough. We’re so hard on ourselves. The only way to turn that around is to actually practice that that come self-compassion fear. Self-compassion that knows I am enough and in my own life the more and more. I’ve done that. That because when I think about my journey where I started when I began my career, I was so painfully shy. You would not even know. I was in the room. I was like a fly on the wall and then I would be beating myself up thinking. Gosh, why did I not say a single thing in that meeting? So, it became this vicious cycle of not showing up as I would like to show up and then just beating myself up and being horrible to myself. And that is not how you grow your confidence. And with the on this mindful Journey, what I’ve seen with myself as well as other women is the more and more you are coming from that place of compassion. What you were doing above all else is giving your mind this belief that it’s safe. It’s safe for me to take risks. It’s safe for me to speak up. Share my voice because even If things don’t go well and let people say, whatever they may, let them judge me. However, they may, I am making this firm promise to myself. That I am not going to judge myself. And when you when you take away that that that punishment of judgment, you start to at least that’s what happened with me. I started to speak up more. I started to assert myself more. I started to put myself out there more, I became more visible, I build my brand, I expanded my work, and I’ve seen this with women after women, which is what gives them the courage to show up more fully. It’s really Self-compassion that leads to courage. So, I think that is what happens at an individual level and equally at an organizational and societal level as well. If you look at, for example, Amy Edmondson is work, where she talks about how the number one thing that allows teams individuals, anyone to take more risks to innovate more is when you create psychological safety in an organization. What is psychological safety again? It’s the same thing. You are creating a space of non-judgment. You can speak your mind. You can take. You can try different things and if it doesn’t work, I am not going to judge you. I am not going to judge you. And so again, psychological safety ties, ties back to two leaders, Mindful and compassionate leaders, creating that sense of safety and belonging for everyone to show up more fully. Different things speak their mind. So absolutely. These are it trickles to, and you see that ripple effect in so many ways. So, there’s yeah.

 

Rodrigo:

So, there’s an individual level and then also, there’s benefits also at this Society level at the group level. I know you, you mentioned, you mentioned about so, you were this is a girl which was very shy and back of them. The room and now today, you’re here, you know, have I mean championing human empowerment and mindful leadership like, and I know you mentioned that for you was important to show up and to be more visible, but I would like to go deeper and tell us like more. How was your journey? What how did you manage to go from that girl in the room shine in the room to where you are now?

 

Bhavna Toor:

So, I think it’s really the big thing, the big piece of it was self-compassion and practicing, that, that acceptance towards myself. The other thing, I think the other thing I will say that I’m a big believer in is discipline. And I’ll tell you how that connects when it comes to confidence, you look at okay. What is confidence? Confidence comes, the Latin from the Latin word, confident are which means to trust to build our confidence. We need to create that self-trust that I can trust myself that I will. When I give myself that assurance that I am going, I can keep my word. I will do what I say I will do and I do that over and over and over and over again over time. That’s how you build self-confidence. So, for me it was interesting because discipline is also the pathway to self-mastery Three and for me, I realized discipline was also that thing that helped me build my confidence. So according to ancient wisdom and philosophy, there are three different kinds of discipline that we can all practice that will give us that sense of self Mastery as well as confidence. One is structural discipline. Structural discipline is for you to look at your day and think about how I can structure my day so that it supports me in showing up as the best version of myself. What do I need to do in the Morning to Meditate do I Journal do I engage in prayer, whatever, whatever is that practice for you? So, you show up as your best self. How do you approach your workday? How do you end your day? Do you end it with gratitude? Do you end it with quality time with your family? What allows you to really end the day Wells because that then connects back to the next morning. How you wake up feeling so structure? Well, disciplined eye on a daily basis. Now, I started with one habit, but now today in my journal, I track 21 different habits every single day, and that’s worked wonders for me, wonders, for me. Because again, it’s about creating those winds for yourself. Every check is through every check your affirming, your identity that this is who I am. This is who I am, because I’m showing up. Is this and again, and that really helped me has helped me build my confidence. So first, structural discipline to reactive discipline, the discipline to when whatever triggers we see, in our environment, whether it’s from, from individuals, or from the circumstances. In our life, the discipline to not react to get triggered and react impulsively, but to create space between that trigger. Or and yourself so that you can respond. Respond thoughtfully, Viktor Frankl said between stimulus and response is a space and, in that space, lies our growth and our freedom. So the more and more through my training I was able to create the space the more freedom I could experience and showing up as myself and the third and final discipline is expansive discipline, which is The discipline to say that I am going to look at everything in my life, as a tool for my personal growth. So, any challenge I come across any challenge in my career from another individual, whatever is I’m going to look at that and ask, how can how do you use this for my growth? How do I in the face of challenge, lean into that and choose growth, rather than eat back into safety and comfort. So, for me, it was a constant journey of every day. Asking myself, how do I, how do I lean in to these challenges in my life, more and more and more? How do I push myself to take more risks, more and more and more? And the more I did that the more I grew in my confidence as well.

 

Rodrigo:

Wow, so much value there, so much to unpack. So first, it’s about the self-discipline. You start with yourself structure. Of the discipline. Then you learn not to react but how to respond to the situations and then the third is about how can you expand in your, in your life, the different areas in your life.

That’s so good. You are in a good direction and I’m going to go deeper. Yes, you mentioned. Also, in one of your posts on social media, which I really liked was, there was an important moment in your life, where you Stop comparing yourself to others and even you had research on that and how that changed your life maybe. Can you elaborate on that?

 

Bhavna Toor:

Yes, yes. So, comparison, oh, gosh, is, is the thing that feeds into our Self Doubt and so much of this again, is because of conditioning. I remember I think I believed I was in Middle School and I In sixth or seventh grade. And I had won this award of most improved student in drama. And I remember feeling quite proud of that because, like I mentioned, I was a shy kid. And for me to get an award for being more expressive was, I was some, it was something I was quite proud of, and I remember, I invited me, my, my father came to the award ceremony. And after the ceremony was over, we were walking home. And I was, I was like, as any kid. I wasn’t desperate. Lee waiting for him to say something to validate the whole experience and he turns around and says, you know, you have you have to work harder, did you see there were there were kids in there who had won four, five six Awards and you only get one, you have to work harder. And look, I love my dad. In fact, my strongest values come from my father especially the discipline that I was talking about. So, I don’t fall. Him because as most parents, we think the way to motivate others is by comparison and then we all internalized this, and we think the way to motivate ourselves is by comparison. I only have a right to like myself if I believe I’m doing better than others. And so, I carry that with me for so, so long and you just fed into the sense of unworthiness in me whenever I felt like I wasn’t doing as good as others. So, I don’t think it was so much a singular moment but more like a growing realization over time that we’re actually all on our own Journey. The thought experiment that I always encourage people to try is think of 10 people, you know? Ask them where they began their journey, how many answers would you get? Ten different answers, some began their journey with a lot of focus and drive knowing exactly what they’re going to do in their life. There are others like me, who took a long time to find their path in life. There are some who grew up with a lot of resources. There are others who struggled now to go back to the same 10 people and ask them. What is their end point? What is the end game? How many answers would you get? Again, 10 different answers for some They want to retire early. You want to retire, Rich. Others are waiting for some Pinnacle in their career and then there’s those who never want to stop working like me third. And I’ll go back to the same 10 people and ask them how they measure success in their life. How many ounces would you get again? 10 different answers. Some of us want a lot of Fame and a claim some of us who want material success. Some of us simply Measuring our success based on how well, we raise our children, it’s different for each of us. So, here’s the thing in any game to pick winners and losers, you need three things. You need a common starting point, a common endpoint, and a common way of measuring success or performance in life. Rarely, would you ever be in a situation? We’re all three conditions are met. I love the way, I actually, how novel Ravikanth phrased. Its life is a single player game It’s a single-player game. We’re not competing with anyone. We’re not comparing ourselves to anyone and find that. That’s the thing that is going to help us. We get to choose what game we’re playing. We get to choose how long we want to play it. We get to choose how we measure our success. So, the more and more, I think I’ve been looking at my life as a single player game. The more also it’s just help me find that confidence. And that’s peace of mind as well.

 

Rodrigo:

So, this is something that what you are mentioning really breaks my heart, see people with so much potential so much potential. But when we start comparing ourselves to others, we start questioning ourselves. And I love what you said. It’s like you cannot compare, it’s completely different. So, I love what you do. Like when we focus on ourselves on our strengths and on our purpose, we became really, really, really powerful. And I think that’s what you did and really, really, really well. So, well. Well done.

 

Bhavna Toor:

Thank you. It’s, I mean, it’s a journey, the journey for all of us.

 

Rodrigo:

Yeah. Yeah, I agree. So, a lot of people are in them in their journey. So now you could leave some tips for, let’s say, managers and leaders who are watching, like what are the three tips that you can give for someone who wants to start or go deepen their journey Into mindful leadership.

 

Bhavna Toor:

So here is one small thing but a really powerful thing that we can all do to increase our self-awareness and to live and lead mindfully is to engage in some kind of daily introspection. All self-aware leaders’ individuals, doesn’t matter, practice some form of daily introspection. So, the first question I would encourage everyone to ask is think about. Imagine yourself at the end of your life on your deathbed, if you will ask yourself, how do you want to be remembered? If there are one or two, or three words that you want everyone to think of when they hear your name, what would they Baby. What would those be? Would you want to be remembered? As someone who’s kind? Someone is courageous someone who was fearless leader. Someone who led life with a lot of Integrity. I think. For each of us we have to decide what that is for us and when you find that Clarity around, okay this this this is this is going to be my true north. I am going I want to craft myself create myself into this kind career. Serious. And, and disciplined individual, a practice that I do. And I know a lot of people do is to make that come alive every single day of your life. So, begin your day by reflecting on. How would I like to show up today? How am I going to practice kindness or courage today? And then, at the end of the day, asked that same question again. How did I show up today? How kind was Today? How courageous was I today? And how can I continue to practice this tomorrow? I think day after day, if you if you keep that alive through that daily introspection, which is what Foster’s that self-awareness that is, what then creates that alignment between, what is most important to you and how you are living your life and how you are showing up.

 

Rodrigo:

So that’s a huge one. Yeah, I’m I think before you mentioned that you, you have 21 habits that you track on a date. For maybe from a lot of people can be a bit of a shock, but I also do the same and they have a daily practice because it’s the beginning of self-awareness and they simply in what you do mention. So, it’s so nice. What do you what do you mention? I think I wouldn’t like to end this conversation. I think I could see the passion for your passion on women empowerment and equality. Like what is the one thing that you would love to see happening in the world? So that we have a more equal world?

 

Bhavna Toor:

I think what we all need to practice what we will all benefit from practicing for ourselves. And for everybody else, is radical acceptance, radical acceptance. What is that? Radical acceptance is where we go beyond Judgment of good and bad for ourselves, or for anybody else but we first begin with acceptance, starting with ourselves and its interesting call Rogers had said, the Curious Paradox is when I accept myself just as I Am, then I change. So, even if change is the aspiration, it first begins with, I accept myself, I accept my life, my everything, the sum total of who I am fully. So, we practice acceptance towards ourselves. So, we practice that radical acceptance towards others, whatever the difference is, whatever the background, we just accept appreciate and value those differences. And when you’re really coming from a place of mindfulness, I practice radical acceptance with this moment right here. This moment, this present moment I accept it fully, because if I don’t, if you don’t, then we’re always going to be looking for happiness, somewhere else. Happiness will always be, it’s in the next moment or the next moment after that, but it’s never here. And if it’s never here, we’re always going to be searched Searching and searching and searching and our whole lives passes by that way. So radical acceptance of this moment of ourselves and each other. So nice. So, we’re coming to the end of the show. Yes, show full of value and emotions. And now I’d like to ask you. So, people ask you a lot of questions. What is one question that people? No way, they don’t ask you and you would love to answer. I think if let’s say if that question is what is really my ultimate message that I would love to leave everyone with and what I believe would be what has been the way I’ve lived my life as well. Is that I think ultimately, if we all focus on On self-mastery and really make showing up as our best selves. The true north along with focusing on the well-being of others. That will always lead us to Greater happiness, greater peace of mind and greater success. I remember Edmund. Hillary who climbed Mount Everest for the first time after He had successfully climbed Mount Everest. He was asked, you know, here you are. You’ve climbed the Summit in the, in the world, the highest Summit. How do you feel any thought about it? And he said, you know, it’s not so much about conquering a mountain as it is about conquering ourselves. And I think living and leading mindfully is very much about that about conquering ourselves. so, we can show up more fully for ourselves and each other. And that’s it.

 

Rodrigo:

It’s I love so much our conversation. It was wonderful to imagine that little girl in the back of the room shy and now seeing you here some as much passion with a lot of purpose, wanting to empower women and help women. And also, was really nice to see the necklace that you are using seeing. There’s also a meaning that the answers were always with view as you mentioned, and I think I love how you are practicing self-mastery and at the end showing up every day at your best. It was awesome. Thank you so much for coming.